From: | Matthew Hoyle <MHoyle@oeclaw.co.uk> |
To: | 'William Swadling' <william.swadling@law.ox.ac.uk> |
'Lionel Smith' <ls2019@cam.ac.uk> | |
obligations <obligations@uwo.ca> | |
Date: | 18/04/2023 16:56:41 UTC |
Subject: | RE: Statutory Exceptions to Privity |
I think Lionel is entirely right that the
source of the rule cannot be determinative of its nature. However, I think a rule being judge made gives a clue as to its nature, because common law courts can (should? have?) only recognised a narrow set of interpersonal rights.
In the common law tradition, a contractual right is one created by the agreement of the parties, supported by a quid pro quo. As I understand the civilian tradition (and e.g. EU rules like those
in Rome I and the Brussels Regime), it is a right created by the consent of at least one party. On that view I think that the Rights of Third Parties Act is probably not a contractual right in the common law tradition, because it does not arise (or need not
arise) by virtue of the agreement of the third party. But it is a contractual right for the purposes of e.g. Rome I.
Against that, one might point to implied terms or more potently to what Simon Whittaker labels ‘statutory terms’ (e.g. those in the Consumer Rights Act 2015). As these rights still arise from the
agreement between the parties, I think they are still within the definition of contractual. But I think its debatable whether that is enough to exclude CROTPA.
Matthew Hoyle
Barrister
One Essex Court
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From: William Swadling <william.swadling@law.ox.ac.uk>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2023 5:51 PM
To: 'Lionel Smith' <ls2019@cam.ac.uk>; obligations <obligations@uwo.ca>
Subject: RE: Statutory Exceptions to Privity
To make the same point another way, we can classify rules according to their source (common law, equity, statute) or their content (criminal, tort, contract, property, etc). What we can’t do, however, is mix these taxonomies. It would,
therefore, be a nonsense to say of a rule that it was a property rule, not a statutory one.
Bill
From: Lionel Smith <ls2019@cam.ac.uk>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2023 5:46 PM
To: obligations <obligations@uwo.ca>
Subject: Re: Statutory Exceptions to Privity
I agree that the distinction between the Code and other statutes is crucial, but I don’t think that touches my point, which is that it is a mistake to think that there is a mutually exclusive distinction between ‘contract’
and ‘statute’. A rule can be a statutory rule of contract, or a codal rule of contract, or a judge-made rule of contract.
In other words what makes something a rule of contract law, or not one, is not what Benoît Moore calls the ‘formal source’ of the rule or what Hart might have called the applicable rule of recognition.
From:
Stéphane Sérafin <Stephane.Serafin@uottawa.ca>
Date: Tuesday, April 18, 2023 at 12:39
To: Lionel Smith <ls2019@cam.ac.uk>, Jason Neyers <jneyers@uwo.ca>, ODG <obligations@uwo.ca>
Subject: RE: Statutory Exceptions to Privity
I’m not sure it’s so strange from a civil law vantage point, actually. There has historically been a rather important difference between a Code, which is meant to embody enduring principles of private law, and a mere
statute. That a statutory rule happens to affect contract law does not mean that it is of the same nature as a rule contained in a Code.
Stéphane
From: Lionel Smith <ls2019@cam.ac.uk>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2023 11:39 AM
To: Jason W Neyers <jneyers@uwo.ca>; obligations <obligations@uwo.ca>
Subject: Re: Statutory Exceptions to Privity
Attention : courriel externe | external email
I don’t know the article, but anyone who has interacted with the civilian tradition (where most of private law is in statutory form) will find the author’s position that you describe rather strange.
If Ontario codified its contract law into a Contracts Act (cf India) would that mean that all contracts made in Ontario would be ‘statutory claims’ and no one had any ‘contractual rights’ any more?
I think the position confuses an inquiry into what makes a rule count as a legal rule (judge-made or statutory) and what makes a rule count as a rule of contract law (see Steve Smith,
Contract Theory).
Lionel
From:
Jason Neyers <jneyers@uwo.ca>
Date: Tuesday, April 18, 2023 at 10:16
To: ODG <obligations@uwo.ca>
Subject: ODG: Statutory Exceptions to Privity
Dear Colleagues:
Many months ago I read a reference to an article arguing that the statutory exceptions to privity of contract are not really exceptions since a person relying on a statutory claim is
in essence suing to enforce an entitlement granted by statute rather than relying solely on the contractual right. Unfortunately, and embarrassingly I cannot seem to find where I found that article referenced (I believe that it was in an Australian treatise
but I have looked and looked to no avail). Does anyone know of this article? I would like to read it and cite it potentially.
Thank you in advance for any assistance!
Sincerely,
Jason Neyers
Professor of Law
Faculty of Law
Western University
Law Building Rm 26
e. jneyers@uwo.ca
t. 519.661.2111 (x88435)
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